Ep. 195 - Joshua Foer: The Explorer's Code

Transcript

This isn't your average business podcast, and he's not your average host. This is The James Altucher Show. Today on The James Altucher Show. One of the most inspirational books I and probably many people listening here have ever read was The Four Agreements by Don Miguel Ruiz. There was another book called The 5th Agreement, which was a beautiful summary of the 4th agreements. It was written by Don Jose Ruiz, his son. And The 5th Agreement is just very inspirational. I highly recommend reading these two books to everyone, and I'm super happy that Don Jose Ruiz is joining me on the podcast today. The 5th agreement, not only is it about your concepts of the 5th agreement, which we'll discuss in a second, but it's also such a great summary of the 4 agreements as outlined in the book by your father, in the book, the four agreements. And, again, this is a book that's been so inspirational to me. I probably read it and reread it every month or so. And then so I was just talking to a friend of mine this morning. He didn't know the book. And I said, turn towards your wife and ask her if she's read the book. And she said, of course, I've read the book. You have to read the book. So it seems like every other person has read the book on the planet. So, I'm very honored you're here. And thank you for the invitation. It's an honor to be with you. I have a few basic questions first, and then we'll talk about what the Four Agreements actually are, and I'll mention them in the in the introduction, which I'll record after this. But who are you? Like, where are you from? I was born in, in Mexico City, and 3 months later, my parents took me to Tijuana to live with them. And, that's where I grew up in Tijuana, and my parents separated when I was probably around 7 or 8. So my father went to the United States, and and I was a a being that was born in the in the border between Tijuana and San Diego. Not not it it was a very interesting, and my family comes from a Toltec tradition, which my grandmother, took on in her in her path and mixed with Catholic and, old tradition mixed in. So this is where my family comes in. And then every generation that's born like my fathers and us, we we we embrace the generations and and turn it into what what the the art of of the Toltec tradition is. And the Toltecs, they were Native Americans who were around even before the Mayans. But somehow they were able to I don't know how the Tolpiks ended or maybe they kind of merged with Mayan civilization, but it's amazing that you were able to keep the traditions alive. Like, how do you know these are the oral traditions that they had even a 1000 years ago? Like the ancestors say, because I only know what answers say, what I experience, is that it's not nothing to do with the words, nothing to do with keeping history. It's to keep the energy of being alive, and we're here surviving. So when knowledge was introduced to us, the words, the creation of dreams, the creation of stories, the creation of suffering, the unnecessary addiction of suffering, so in this moment, we are our experience, our consciousness, our integrity, and against the illusion that the words create. So in all the generation, you can see goodness, negativity, you know, wars, peace, all coming up because it's just a dream of the of the illusion of common sense and, and the world that creates stories. And people believe the stories, people make superstition, but it comes a moment in life when we know that we're not for eternal, that we're permanent, citizens in this world. And and that moment, we begin seeing what, like, you know, like, one of my favorite singers, Bruce Dickinson, from Iron Maiden says, life down here is a strange illusion because everybody protects the addiction. So the moment that we wake up knowing that we're living in a dream, that is when we continue on the tradition of the Toltec tradition because life is an art. And the interesting thing is to see the war of the gods, which was made by the war of wars, and that's our heritage to humanity that we're battling ourselves in order to find things to be happy. Look for things to be happy. Look for things to be successful, to be validated. But no one says, hey, we got it. The only thing we need to do now is survive. You know, like a mosquito survives the spider webs of life. And from this point on, we create mythologies. It's so true because and and you mentioned this in the book, The 5th Agreement, how all of these words, words in general, symbols in general, are something that mankind as a species created. So all these stories that we believe about our lives, they're not necessarily the truth that's 1,000,000,000 of years old. They're just our particular story of our life. Like whether we're bad or good or handsome or ugly or successful or not successful. And I'm just curious before you started, like, obviously, your father was writing about all of these things. Before you started yourself down this path, what was your life like? Like, where were you messing up? Well, the the the first thing that I had, it was my the love of my family, which is all beautiful. I there was no complaints about that. The interesting part was when I begin being a teenager and begin talking to friends. And in Tijuana, I grew up in this, neighborhood where, you know, where peer pressure is there, so you have to prove yourself. And little by little, I rebel against our tradition because, like, when we were going to church or going to Sunday school, you know, and I begin, getting to hang out with kids in my neighborhood. So little by little, I begin taking on their stories. I I begin, you know, pretending what I'm not. And then it led me to drug addiction when I became, a addict with Crystal Net. Mhmm. And when I went to that world, you know, I ran away not knowing what I was running away. It was just trying to fit in the peer pressure, but I got lost into that world. Now the tradition of the Toltec is if you send your your apprentice to the jungle and he comes back, he cast medicine. But if they don't come back, you know, the jungle would take them, and they would fulfill the work of the jungle. But in this moment, for me, in a generation of the peer pressure, in the nineties, in that generation where all these drugs and all these things are happening in Tijuana, well, I I felt I felt like a like a mouse in a mousetrap, so that became my jungle. Now I'm learning to be that character. I'm learning to hold that addiction to suffering those stories and let go of that substance. That was the the thing that make me value life. Because it's not about attaining all the information, knowing everything of the traditional. It's about valuing life. And whoever values life, that is the real richness and wisdom of this world. So that that was my tradition. So when I go teaching about, my father's work, it's not that I ever dream about writing books or teaching with him. It's that the moment that I wanted to live back again, I I got my apprentice with my father, and then he had a heart attack. So when he had a heart attack, he was like, it's now or never, you know? My your father dies, you're not gonna no one's gonna come and help you is is now to show and that moment is when I said, oh, I have a choice right here. And the path of the Tolteq is to, you know, to not learn, but to unlearn everything that you sabotaged your life with because in the Toltec, it means artists, artists of the spirit. So we create art with whatever we experience of life. So let's say everything that I went through, it was meant to happen because it happened, but it gave me medicine to share it with other people like me. I like that viewing it as viewing experience as medicine. That's very powerful. And so what when do you when you were kind of the mouse in the mousetrap, when you were in the jungle, I realized that then you later became apprentice with your father, but what was your first steps out of the jungle? Like, when did you realize this wasn't you weren't living according to the tradition that now you live? Yeah. What the the same thing that scares many people, honesty and responsibility. Yes. I created this. I cannot blame anybody else for where I am. So if I put myself into this place, I can get myself out of this place. And that's when I really got introduced to my willpower, because the willpower is the faith that I have in me, and the faith activates the intent. Now the intent, it gets put into the word that makes the word powerful. Now what am I going to believe? Where's my power of belief that I'm the victim, that I cannot do it, or that I want to live? And in that moment, I don't want to play games with myself anymore. Was there an incident that scared you enough that you were like, oh, no. I need to start finding my way out of the jungle. There were so many incidents. So many incidents. And the moment that I felt safe, I continue on again. You know, my my body went to trauma, went to, well, close things to death, you know, my body getting abused. And I think that's the part when I said no more, because when I got abused, it was I began using in a different point of view. I wasn't not using it for creativity, for fun, or just to fix. I was, like, looking for a darkness. And then when one of my friends said to me in Tijuana, if you stay here, you will die. You better get out. And I never expected him to say that to me. But in that moment, it was like, people say the angels exist, you know, in the I never seen an angel with wings, but I see angels like brothers and sisters, and that brother was an angel in my life. And and I I took him dearly and I did what I was feared most. I I left my my Tijuana home, and that's when I I begin jonesing when I was in the states. And one day, I got, caught with a little substance of, of of of of marijuana in my pocket, and I went to secondary inspections. I got detained. So in that moment, I was with my with my mother and grandmother, and I really woke up saying, oh my god. I have to control my my body. You know? I have to really take care of my body, and that is the moment that I begin waking up. And this is the interesting part. In one moment, I'm in the alleys. I'm in the rock. I I I got arrested in the borders, detained. And then a week later, I'm in the pyramids of Giza, entering the pyramids with my father had an anthropologist friend, so they let us inside. And I'm saying, this is interesting. How did I get so lucky to be here? I felt like another opportunity. And especially in that moment, my father did a ceremony where we lay in one of those tombs, and I and he said, you have a new life now. And he said to me, don't bring your past your dead dream into your living dream. And that's been a challenge, but it is a balance. So, you know, the thing is that when we wake up, those memories don't go anywhere, but they've become a moment of strength for us that we overcame it. And that is when our body feels gratitude. Now the thing is, if something happens, you let me get upset, we got heartbroken, are we gonna punish our stuff for that? And I that's what I learned. My body has not reason to be punished, but it took a lot of times. It took a lot of times to really love Jose because I didn't love Jose. Right. Like and you you mentioned this in the in the book, so much that the it's not like you read the book and and say, you know, like, the the second agreement is don't take things personally. It's not like one day you you say, okay. I'm never gonna take things personally again. It it requires a lot of practice, but it's so difficult. Like and I'll ask this about each of the agreements, but how do you not take how do you practice not taking things personally? It's really the the one that I find out to not take things personal was to to stop playing with the word of the gods because we take it personal because, let's say, in the book, my father explains that we're all open with wounds, and we're inviting people to touch our wounds. And when they touch it, we snap because that's the addiction of suffering going back and back. Now when I when my father was in the in the in the hospital in coma, he said that people that I love will will feel and take it personal, and they will unleash on me for the life I took. They will blame you. And and and one and he said, just don't take them personal because that's the invitation of your old self. And then when that was happening, when my father was in coma and and I just got out this journey that I got to and somebody said that that's my fault that happened to my father, that it was my fault for the kind of life that I took. A part of me wanted to take it personal, but wisdom came in. I didn't wanna shoot that old bubblegum anymore, and this is when my father really trained me. When people attack us and we take it personal, they're only asking for help. And and and this is what I really, really begin seeing it as a translation. When people attack me or I take it personal and instead of asking for help now, it's the moment that we can create medicine again. That's that's fascinating. So, basically, you could kinda it's almost like you're an alchemist, you know, who converts all of these bad experiences into medicine. And not only do you heal yourself, but you heal those around you. Because if you then attack this person back by taking it personally, you would have touched his wound. Yes. And and one of the things that many people are afraid to do in life is to feel. To feel the conversation that our physical body is talking to us. Like, when we get nervous, when we get anxious, the body is asking for help. But in this moment, instead of wanting to listen to the body because we're afraid of the emotions, we suppress it. You know? And and this is one of the things that people numb themselves out. But the moment that you no longer numb yourself, that you really want to listen to the baby or to your pet, that's in the defense of the child, it's your body. It's talking to you. And it on on or he can communicate, I feel in pain, I feel happy. And that woman, you really walk a line because now, if we say we serve divine mother, like in my tradition, we serve God, we serve divine mother, we serve father. It's not in the outside, it's our physical body. And when we do that, we feel okay. But if we don't take care of our physical body, we we let abusive people, you know, put poison in our head every day. We don't do nothing until we explode. That is not love. We have to really take care of the physical body. That's why many people are afraid to talk to certain people who respect themselves. So how did you respond to that person who said that thing about you causing your father's illness? Well, the moment that that person wanted a debate Mhmm. I was gonna lose that debate because the mind set up. There's no time to waste. It's time to just feel my emotion, getting attacked, calm down, and and walk away. Yeah. Because there's nothing else to say. And and I guess this goes along with, you know, the the 3rd agreement which is, don't make assumptions. And we don't you you can't assume where that person's coming from. And, you know, it's I feel like that goes hand in hand with don't take take things personally, and it's part of that part of the same practice. Yeah. Because many anytime when we take it personal, we only see our part of the story, and we make assumptions about whatever is happening in the other part. But if we have the little opportunity to trinkle our emotion and ask the question that we're afraid to, we we might find a different response of where that person is coming from. But right away, you know, we don't want to listen to other people. We want to write their secondary star character in our story that benefit for us in our digital suffering, that we be are totally selfish. You know, we're totally selfish in this way of living. But if we ask questions, and we begin listening, we begin totally saying, oh, this is common sense if you do 1 and 1 is 2. Yeah. And and, you know, when you write about the 5th agreement, which is, you know, be skeptical and always listen, I really like how you put it with, imagine every human being is an artist. And so when someone else is talking, regardless of what they're saying, you're listening to another artist, And it's always worthwhile listening to another artist, even if they're saying something that you don't agree with or they're attacking you or whatever. It kind of it kind of almost creates a different story. It reframes the situation that's happening. Yes. Exactly. And that's the important thing to know that we all are translators. We're translating English to English, Spanish to Spanish, you know, because we're understanding worlds. And when we understand, like, what a person is screaming, we can talk to that person not in what we believe in, what they believe in. Like, my father began training us when we were children. You know, me and my brother, Michael, we always look into America, to the wonder gears, to pop culture, to music because, you know, that was like something we we watched, and we were kids watching, cartoons, you know, in the mornings, you know, and then came Super Mario. So our attention was not in Quetzalco, Din Taloc, or nothing about the Toltec tradition. It was with pop culture. And my father had to come into our world, not make the assumption that we're born and we should know, but, you know, no. He begins seeing how we dream. And then one day he said, okay, these guys love Super Mario, it's a game. And then he said, you know, that Toltec tradition is just like Super Mario Brothers, he said to us. Then we turn around, we put the controllers down. And he said, yes, first you have to master what the toy does. Then you have to master what the world is. So he was translating the Toltec tradition world into Super Mario World to get our attention. Now when that gets set, Super Mario World evaporate, like a teaching. And here comes another layer of the teaching. But this is the beautiful thing about listening to people's world, listening to people's mind, and this is what in the tradition we call the clean mirror. And I like the idea of framing our lives as these stories, these narratives that we build in our minds because it almost distances yourself from the story, from from the life that you think you've created. And that gives you a way to kind of analyze it a little deeper. And, like, for you, what it means the hero of a story, what does that mean? Like, how do you be the hero of your story? Inspiration. Whatever inspires me out of a dream. Mhmm. If I am living in an abusive relationship, I will look what will inspire me out of that dream, knowing that there's many dreams out there. But when I'm not enjoying a dream, it's time to be loyal to the love of my life. And this is who I'm married in life, to death do us part. Yes. I may open my heart and meet somebody, grow a beautiful family between together. It's a beautiful thing to for me to be the better version of myself. It's a gift to my family. It's a gift to everybody. So in this moment, like we say earlier, we are artists, and the art that we do is ourself. Like my father explains in one of his latest books, the actor, how many people, they get upset in their forties or fifties. They get upset, and right away, they want to get the role of their teenage years when they were a victim, you know? And they've played the role very good. So in that moment say, okay, all these roles that I played in my life, they were based on what? Are they really real? And they were not. So that moment, we free ourselves from our own art. And many people, you know, they cannot free themselves from their own art. And that's why the the addiction of suffering, bring the animal of safety, the pain that they're used to will be carried from relationship to relationship because they cannot detach from that, because they're not honest with what accepts them because it's themselves. And that is the beautiful thing about ending the world of belief, the world of the gods, the world of words is being impeccable with it. And then life will challenge you again and again and again and again. The important thing is to be service to the love of your life. That is you. And that is presented with gratitude, loyalty, and respect. Yeah. It it's interesting because one of the masteries you talk about is is mastering transformation. And if you think about it, an artist has to do that as well. Like, if you if Picasso only created one type of art his whole life, he wouldn't have been Picasso. Like, he went from the blue period to cubism to whatever. And an artist, I guess, always has to think of what's what's that next step? What's the next chapter in my story? Like, how do I improve? I guess, how to find more medicine in some sense. Yes. It's like the hummingbird. It will always look for nectar, and we're like the hummingbirds looking for nectar that will inspire us, and we all are different. You know? Some of us get inspired by fashion, by music, by meditation, by history, by politics. It gets so many inspiration that we all have a mission here in life, but the mission is not that we have to do. It's a labor of love, and that's what people forget. Many people wanted to do with validation or pretending, because there's a lot of pretending, then that's what corrupts the world. Corrupts politics, corrupts spirituality, corrupts religion, corrupts the workspace. But the moment that we are just grateful in life, that there's nothing to attend, we just create to be an artist. And what a great artist does, respect other people's art, no matter what they live life. Just like I didn't respect myself as an artist, as a musician because I only know how to play 3 chords in that time when I played with a master guitar player and he told me, come on Let's play together said I can play with you. I don't know how to play. Okay. He accepted that But then he heard me jamming, you know this this 3 chord jamming song and he said you lied to me I didn't lie you're playing right now And then he gave me the gift saying, just because you know how to play 3 chords and I know how to play a 100 chords, I'm not gonna show up and stomp all over you. I'm gonna communicate with you in those 3 chords back and forth. And that's the beautiful thing about art, is the there's so many levels of awareness. But like I said earlier, behind all those words is the present. And this is where we are at because that's the the nectar that we are feeding off, our own nectar. Well and this is related actually to the 4th agreement, always do your best. And you say in in the book, the 5th agreement, you say how it's not like we've ever we're ever doing 80% or 20%. We're always doing a 100%. We're always a 100% here, and I'm trying to kind of understand this. So what is your best? Well, the best for me is when I do something I love to do. And if I don't judge myself, no one else can judge me. And I do my best without the invitation to the party of judgment. Judgment is not welcome to the party because many people do their best, but they still feel guilty for not bringing water from a stone, which is impossible. Mhmm. I see. So for instance, if you love playing tennis, but you're not the best tennis player in the world, don't, you know, always do your best. You don't have to be the best according to some outside metric. You just have to do your best. Yes. Exactly. Like, and and one time, Nikki Sixx from what the crew was explaining that agreement especially, and he was saying that on a Friday, he played the baseline, you know, in certain way that, Saturday Sunday, I believe he was beating himself up. I should've played it this. I should've played it this way. I should've played it this way, which I was his best. And you know, you know what? Just on Monday or Tuesday, I will play it differently. And I will stop beating myself up because I cannot change what he was, but I can change what he's going to be. That's why when we do art and we do, we're not trying. We're doing. And to fly, a little bird has to do the intent to split its little wings until it goes forward. It's not gonna do it in the first thing. Yes. It it's so interesting, and and it's so interesting you bring this up because I'll admit, I feel guilty over you know, for many years, I would I always like doing things that I love. And but in a lot of, of modern society, it's about, no. Wait. Do the things that make money or else you might regret it later because you won't you'll you'll I don't there's many reasons why people say that. And so then I wonder, did I waste the past 6 years doing x, y, or z? Because I always focus like, doing a podcast even, I'm not necessarily doing the things that make money. Podcasting doesn't really make a lot of money, but I love doing this. And sometimes I do regret like, oh, what if I had spent the last 10 years building other businesses instead of writing or doing the other things that I love doing. And I do feel that regret sometimes. You know, one of the most powerful the most powerful currency that exists in the world in my point of view is time, because no one can buy time. And when we waste the time, it's like the $7, we cannot recreate it. And, when I got to this point of thinking, I was writing from San Miguel de Agenda to Mexico, and, the person who was giving me a ride to to Mexico City said that he gives rides to one of the most powerful persons in Mexico. And, and one time that person was in the back seat, and they were driving in this mountains. And in this mountain, there was this person who carries to has chip, and that is, just carrying the chip everywhere around the mountains. And in that moment, the person was sitting down with his chip. And then the the the powerful person from Mexico who was sitting in the back car, They he asked the driver just hey Who do you think is more richer? That person in the mountain or me? And of course, you know the the driver of course you sir Yeah, thank you for saying that but no, it's not true. I may have money. I may have businesses. I'm on the phone all the time, but someone always wants something from me. I always have to wash my back. I don't have time to do the things I love. That person is rich because he's in nature. He has little animals that love them. And in the moment I got it, you know, no matter what we do in our life, if we're enjoying it, we're loving it, that's the richness. Because even the little kids watching us, they will enjoy, you know, enjoying life instead of beating themselves up, thinking that they have to fill up the piggy bank, not use it, and then die. Yeah. No. It seems like you're right. At the end of the day, there's nothing other than our experiences, and did we love them or not? And, you know, so talk to me about the first agreement, be impeccable with your word. And and, honestly, when I first read the 4 agreements, that was the agreement that stuck in my mind the most. Like, if you're always impeccable with your word, you don't have to worry about living a double life. You don't have to figure out which word you said to which person. It's it it greatly reduces your stress. Yeah. And so that was the power of it. As opposed to other people thinking, oh, this is an honest person, The real gift is to yourself when you're impeccable with your word. But Exactly. Why is that the first one? Because the the words in this world is the bricks that create the buildings. It's the foundation. So if our foundation is not made impeccably, it will fall. And like you said earlier, when we're impeccable with our words, when we're honest and our hearts an open book, no one can judge us. No one can blackmail us. No one can bully us. And this is what happens when people bully themselves with their own word, but they're not impeccable with it because they use their own word against themselves. And now to think about the bible, first was the word and the word was with God and the word was God, and God presents creation. In the tradition, the words create stories, the words create illusion, the word create dreams. So we use the word to create a beautiful dream, or we can use it to create a nightmare of a life like I used to do, the complaining, pointing fingers, until one moment, I felt like an elder as I look around my life, and I see everybody like children. And like my stepmama, Gaia, before she passed away, she mastered something in her life, to love everybody like they were their own children. And then I challenged myself. Could you imagine, Jose, loving everybody like they were your own brothers and sisters, no matter what they're dreaming? If you see a little kid pretending to be a doctor, pretending to be a power ranger, are you gonna cut its wings? You know, it it's interesting you use the analogy also of how humans are like magicians. And so when they say words, it's like they're casting spells. And, you know, and it made me think, you know, some people are more powerful with words than others, and, hence, even more so the importance of being impeccable with your word. And it's really true that words are the way we convince each other. Words are are the way we convince ourselves. Words are the way we tell stories that create these realities for people. And so I guess practicing being impeccable with your word helps you to create the best reality in some sense in that magical way. Yeah. It leads you to inner faith because you begin having faith in yourself because you feel it. You feel the life force. You feel your intent. And that's what faith does. It creates an intent to make your magic. And now your words are more are very powerful with intent that, you know, they have energy towards it, that it will make an impact. Like my father explains the poor agreements, he put himself in that book and every word, he put his intent. When the book is in the table, it's dead. Then when someone picks it up, it becomes a mirror. Because one person said, I know this information. I feel like I know it. It's because it's our integrity, and integrity is the act of intent. So when we live in this way of life, if we begin practicing the impeccability of the word, you know, it's like we wake up and we cannot go back to sleep ever again. Yeah. And and and this leads to the the 5th agreement, of course, which is be skeptical because everyone, like you said, they're all everybody's casting spells with their words, but it's always based on their own experiences. So being skeptical might not mean rejecting everything, but just listening without letting the spell take control of you over you, someone else's spell. And and, you know, it's very easy to be skeptical to the outside world. But the powerful thing about the faith agreement is to be skeptical of our own negativity, of our own poison, of our own misuse of the word, of our own suppressor, that is our self. And many people say they love divine mother, that they love divine mother, but they suppress themselves within their own words. So the act of the is to, you know, to elevate divine mother, to love divine mother. And no matter we're male or female, this is the body of mother because this belongs to planet Earth. Now we have awareness that this is a creature of the divine of life. This is a living force. Now we are that intended energy that comes into this container. We're more than we can think of. But, you know, it's not really important to know why, because we have to know why we will know why. It's the beautiful, the mystery of life, the exploration, to take to the journey, to believe in ourself, and to change history is like our ancestors did before us. They did what was said impossible. They went beyond fear, and they cleared the pathway for us to continue doing the work. And like, we were talking earlier, the nihilism, when the conquistadors came, when it never went anywhere, it just went into hiding, it went to the underworld. And the underworld is the home of the wisdom. Why? Because when we all go into the dark place, into suffering, into pain, into a broken heart, that's where life comes out from. And whatever lessons we learned from that, we're taking it to the surface, to the light. And we're taking the torch of our ancestors, the torch of humanity for a better dream forward. And what about, like, sometimes it's kind of great to think about these things after bad experiences, but sometimes it's particularly hard during bad experiences to re to practice this, to remind yourself of this. Like, you know, for instance, you know, there was one point in my life where my father also got sick, and he never got better. And that sort of taught me that things don't always cycle. Sometimes things just go from bad to worse to death. And at the same time, I was going broke. I was going through a divorce. At that time, it was really hard to not tell myself a negative story about what was happening in my life. And, you know, I tried as hard as I could to not be negative, but it's very difficult during those times. Yeah. I I'm with you. I was in the same place, and especially when the world tells you how you have to respond to that, how you have to feel for that. Now it's my time to unleash that, and, you know, and many people come and remind you all the time. But in in in one point, you know, that became our our strength. That became our strength because that woke us up from, you know, being stuck and say, I want to live or I want to die. And that moment, even that suffering becomes, you know, a habit. A habit that, oh, here it comes. Here comes with all the the the emotion, all these stories. And in that moment, the the thing we have to do is the yoga exercise. Get comfortable in the uncomfortableness. Because many people, you can see when you enter a yoga room and say, oh, that person so advanced I can never do that. But when we are in that pain, when we're in that nightmare that we feel like we cannot is that we are in a post that is so uncomfortable, and we can't get out because there's still 20 more minutes to go in the class, but we're breathing in, breathing out. But what's magical is that the class will end one day, and we'll become more flexible when the the next pain comes in our way. Let's say, the first marriage for me was awful. You know? I I continue on paying for that. But now, all of these things that I learned during the second relationship, I brought that in, but now I want to be the better version of myself. Not for a relationship, but for myself and others, because I don't want to be reminded everywhere I go. So this is the interesting part about life. When we're an open heart, when we don't lie, when we're honest about everything, because we're not judging ourself, the police go away somehow. And and I said to my dad one time, dad, this is strange that I like to be judged. He goes, why? It's because it's where I get creative. That's interesting. So you or that's how that's that medicine. One judgment is a medicine for you to take for to to cure your creativity in a sense. Yes. And then I go through it, and then I talk to somebody, and then I know, oh, now I know why I tasted that. So, Don Jose Ruiz, this is such a pleasure. I've been such a fan for so long of the 5th agreement and your father's books, the 4th agreement, and also his book, the mastery of love, where something always stands out for me, which is never outsource your love for yourself to another person. It's such a beautiful concept. I I wanted to ask you where where can people find you? Where do people learn more? Where do people where where is the best place people can learn more from you? Well, the family huddles in the MiguelRiz dot com, but I love to get in the Instagram and share little videos or share little messages. And in the time of COVID, I did a year and a half of videos every Monday. So I have a lot of videos if people want to get on there and just, like, it goes from, like, 10 minutes to 50 minutes each video. So I I get a lot of, teachings there that is available. But, yeah, Instagram, for me, I like to share. What's your Instagram account? Donfosterwiz. Okay. And one last question, which is I I didn't know this, but are you blind? No. I was blind because when I was younger in my teeth, I I got into drug addiction and I snorted. So when I quit 2 years later, the when I went to get a root canal, it affected my eyesight, so I went blind for almost, like, 3 weeks. Okay. Yeah. I read about that. But my eyesight came back. But, the interesting part about that, it was that I was blind before. When I lost my eyesight is where I I really begin finding my instincts, and I begin feeling connected to the, especially to the bat, the animal, which is one of the very inspirational that I the Power Animal book got made. Like we were talking earlier, when life takes something away from us and we accept it, we continue. But if life takes something away from it and we complain, we will always stay in that place of suffering. That's such a good point, and I'm gonna remind myself because lately, I find myself complaining more than usual, and I don't quite know why I am doing that. But I have to I have to remember that that words are are magic spells, and I'm casting a spell on myself. So I have to remind myself of that, and I have to remind myself of all these things that you write. And so, Don Jose Ruiz, author of The 5th Agreement and many other books, thank you so much. It's really been such a pleasure having you on the on the show. Oh, thank you, James. Thank you for this invitation. And I and I and I I wish to do it again. It had so it went so quick. Oh, yeah. Absolutely. Any any time. We'll we'll be in touch. I would love to have you on again. Yes. I would like there's so much to talk about. Yes. Thank you, Don Jose. Thank you, Gabe.